OMG, Rangers can use bows! Thats not fair, i want it too. Sorry but Rangers are not our reference. Even if they do more damage and had more tools and are cooler and run faster and had a pet and a wife and two children - erm, love it? -> reroll it.


Im not 50, im 44 - im Dragon from "first level". Invested 1 day time to prove harmo with 44, done it couple of hours in top graystone group and done it even longer solo. Sorry but between Harmo and Dragon are WORLDS. You cant even near play that hard like Dragon as a Harmo. As fast as dragon falls - so fast he kills, same at harmo too.
And if your styles crit for good 2K more and in backgroud are two dots running for about 3-4K at tick together and you still say "its not that more than a harmo" sorry than you are playing different game as me.

And dont coment please something like "with lvl50 is its other play and endu gear and and"  at the end - no matter what gear can Harmo monk get , same dragon can. And its still 24% more damage and 40% less endu needed that harmo cant match.

Dragon is maybe not ranger or sorc or whatever in DPS, but still best dps of monks (jea i know if Drunken his 3rd and 4th style in T.Fist chain crit and if he had a bard in group and if if if if if if than he makes more DPS as a dragon that had 5 hits without crit and no crit on PEH and was to long Fd and and and and and jada jada jada)

One wise man said "People just feeling fine when they feel bad".
In most of posts here i read this thing. Everything is black, bad, all others are better.

Sorry for my sarcasm (now i do some sarcasm) but this thread should help QTM for better sugestions for Devs - we are loosing the point atm. Im just tired about this "all other are niceer than monks" thing.....

Deshiro you miss the point, a harmonious monk can negate the penalty of their offensive stance, which further improves the quality of the stance, yes i know dragon can get +end regen gear and attack non stop, but theres a reason theres a 40% penalty on endurance cost, its because without that penalty the original developers thought the crit rate would be too high.  Granted Endurance regen will be fixed and then harmonious monks dps will be hit rather hard.

My comparission to rangers was to say a 15% dps/10% crit buff wouldnt be out of line or over powered because other classes already have similar skills that stack with thier offensive stance, and you were insinuating that i was asking for rediculously over powered skills.

Maybe its just your bad english (im assuming your european) but your original suggested ae proc had a lot of elements that didnt seem appealing at all to me.  Maybe i just misunderstand what you are trying to suggest, but from what i got out of it it seemed very unappealing.  I dont want to discourage other people from posting and giving their suggestions, because i know i cant think of every possible buff id want. 

Like draxs said though, as is i keep it on my bar for the resists, if it went to a pbae or pbae proc i would take it off my bar and never use it again, ae's are that bad and unless a raid mob spawns 1 or 2 dot adds, youll never use ae's to drop 2 group mobs at the same time or 2 raid mobs at the same time. 

So far the suggestions are as follows (in no order):
Pulse ae 1 min up 5 min down
Perm/1hr buff of +30% spell damage
+dmg/crit  % modifier +15% dmg 5% crit (same as rogue/ranger buff)
DD proc (maybe count melee dmg)
Dot proc (some kinda 30 sec duration that does dmg + decreases resistance to spells)
Root/stun immunity
Bonus to ae's - let them hit in waves/multiple htis, increase their damage

The overall consensus is
MAke it 30min/60min/perma, ie make it last longer then 10 min, with the duration depending on the effect
Leave the fire resist on it
manipulate the Damage shield into something more useful

I dont know why but i have the sudden desire to have sundragon corona also have an illusion Dragon componet.  LIke the forms of shamans. 

It was probably the comment "- Crush: crushing people with their bodies" because i cant see my monk crushing anything other then a gnome with my body. 

For my example:
1 hr buff
+30% spell damage
+220 sv fire
Illusion: Dragon (about the size of a full size half giant)

Then we could get other spells later on in future expansions / as droped skills all with their own dragon illusion like:

Earth Dragons Corona
1hr buff
+20% mitigation
immune to stun

Wind dragons corona
1 hr buff
+10% evasion
+levitate

Water dragons corona
1hr buff
10% haste
+enduring breath


In compensation drunken monks would be able to choose the type of beer/liquor to get drunk off! and harmonious monks can walk around with bird seed, peace pipes, and tie dye shirts!  (jk on this last part)

I had another idea for an ability added to Sun Dragon's Corona. How about a pulsing Jin Surge type ability? Every X seconds, a free +Y bonus on the next melee attack made by players in the group within a 10m radius of the Monk. This would both give us a bit of utility AND be an AE effect I'd use myself.

Discussion doesn't negate respect for another's opinion. And how are the devs to implement a change if we can't reach a consensus on what the best change would be?

There are no "Bad" Ideas.

Like Desh said we all have our take. My perspective is obvious, i look at it from a raid point of view.

If it will not benifit me in a raid enviorment I don't have any regards for it. Die to crow control purposes I never use any form of AE's on raids. People get kicked out of raids for stuff like that.

So that is my take and why I would hate to see it go the way of yet another AE for Dragon monks.

I already am disapointed that we have an entire chain that is wasted to AE's.

I agree with fijutsu that the lines between the styles right now are far too blurred. I do not think that was the Dev's intentions but it is in fact the case at this time. Adding in AE's to what is suggested to be the DPS style does nothing for me in terms of increasing DPS. I raid, I could not care less about how much damage I can hit some level 20 2 dot mobs for and how many of them I can hit at 1 time.

It is my opinion that the Dev's do indeed invision Dragons as the DPS style and are working to make it more clear cut.

That being said I would like to see them replace our AE chain with an average single target chain and keep the AEs as regular abilities. Dragon rakes its claws and whirlwind are plenty for AE's. We have little to no need for an entire chain dedicated to them.

Honestly if you are AEing and have enough time to use all 3 of your chain abilities as well as mixing in a Dragon rakes it claws and whirlwind, your as good as dead. thats about 14 seconds or so worth of time you were AEing, Why even bother with watching for your crit chain AE when you can spam click the 2 regular abilities.

Back on track, making Corona be an AE or having AE damage components is fine but it will simply sit in the abilties tab for most all raiders, never seeing the light of day onto the hotbar.

Oh yeah, Dragon's Breath. I completely forgot about that one.

Can honestly say I have never used it. Doesn't it cost like 6-8 jin or something? Yeah, like if I had 6 jin that is the button I'm going to push.. 

I have to agree with you on the chain. They will likely never change it although I do believe they know it's pretty useless.

One of the styles has like 3 different Thousand fists chains don't they?

How did the DPS stlye get stuck with 1 and an AE chain?