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Vanguard Monks  |  Monk Discussion  |  Monk General  |  Monk Issues « previous next »
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Author Topic: Monk Issues  (Read 1235 times)
Fusoya
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« on: May 24, 2007, 10:13:29 AM »

Many people are mentioning the scaling of exploding heart damage, fairly recently the first two steps have had damage added to them...but do not count as ability damage. This means secret of celerity and errant strikes do not modify the first two portion of this attack, and as far as I am concerned remove this ability from all use while those are activated. It is not worth sacrificing two double damage attacks to have a slightly higher third swing.
-Make the first two attacks for exploding heart chain count as ability damage.

Flying kick and kick of the heavens need a major damage boost. Something is being lost here, boundless fist is consistantly out damaging the flying kick and kick of heavens finishers...which in my eyes are supposed to be rewards for criting. Not much function is left in them if they put out less damage then our normal combat attacks. The reason I bring this up is not for scaling purposes, but I believe there to be something missing from the coding involved. Looking at the ability description this should never be the case, as the kicks have a higher damage formula according to tool tips.

Pulling. As of two patches ago (I believe when the FD 'pause' was first implemented) mob pathing has really gone down the crapper. Mobs are constantly getting stuck or rooted on invisible terrain, forcing pullers to literally walk up to the mob to get him to become unstuck and follow. Casting and ranged mobs can become un-pullable as well as making splitting very difficult. Aside from the pathing issues, the pause looked like a step in the right direction for FD, but the fact some mobs out of a pack can still remain in combat makes the pausing very time consuming when trying to split mobs while you are in combat. Keeping in mind the failure rate for 50+ mobs is quite overwhelming to begin with, I think that with the pause added again, a total resist / fail formula must be put in place. Or once again time restraints will remove monks from the task of pulling.

With raid testing taking place, spell casting mobs are becoming more and more of a bane to monk pulling. I would like to revisit the idea for some sort of monk ability to allow spell avoidance as many dots / roots and debuffs can have a monk dead without a chance. When splitting a pack of 4+ casters, if each one lands a dot the monk struggles to survive bringing one back to the group, even if it is singled with relative ease. This not only provides a great deal of risk, but also puts the healer in a tough spot to decide whether to heal and draw aggro or let the monk die from a dot. (there are ways around them pulling aggro, but depends on situation / classes). The most obvious solution in my eyes would be to add an ability such as RiTW but for spell avoidance, or simply increase spell avoidance in relation to melee avoidance. Not sure why this isn't the case already, as melee mitigation adds spell mitigation.

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Quinn the Mighty
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« Reply #1 on: May 24, 2007, 01:11:20 PM »

Regarding PEH will get a tweak upwards, I personally think all 3 stages should deal damage or have some other effect in addtion to a big damaging finisher.  I mean Hammer fist just screams for a "Stun" type effect, not sure what 3 Finger Strike could do though.

Regarding Kick skills; when you get the nicer 50+ HTH weapons your kick abilities doesn't work quite as good as melee damage abilities. I think there needs to be some type of scaling or transition to melee damage at 50 or some combitnation of the two so that skills that use kick don't get left in the dust.

Regarding Pulling; Pulling will get it's proper share of love, but it will be a 2 step process. with regard to spell avoidanceI think it would be a great thing I do believe it has been slated as AA stuff but I can double check on it.

~QTM


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MBchrono
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« Reply #2 on: May 24, 2007, 01:25:46 PM »

In PvP, when I fight my buddy, if he sees I do thee finger strike he just stuns me cause he knows he is about to become very dead.  Maybe switch hammer fist to the first attack and make it stun, 3 finger strike could be the 2nd attack and lower mitigation by a small amount, and then of course finish off by exploding some hearts.

Quinn, can you recommend any good 50+ H2H weapons?  I still use pantheon weapons due to the insane crit amount.  I havn't found anything that compares.  Others might have 20+ dps more than my weapons, but I can crit on almost all attacks, especially in storm dragon stance.  I ask you because maybe I have missed the introduction of GOOD H2H weapons other than godking and greystone, which are just horrible.
« Last Edit: May 24, 2007, 01:27:41 PM by MBchrono » Logged
Quinn the Mighty
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« Reply #3 on: May 24, 2007, 05:00:47 PM »

Good idea about the stun 1st, lower mitigation then **BLAMO* providing the damage gets to where it needs to be.

I had a coversation going about HTH weapons with a couple of people and right now the Panthenon Ulak is arguably the best off hander. Right now god king / A claws are pretty much it for main hand.

Monk itemization is a known issue so I hope they throw more gear to help us along.

~QTM
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Fusoya
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« Reply #4 on: May 25, 2007, 01:06:50 PM »

Afrit heroic claw is probably the best primary hand weapon atm.
I agree that pantheon is best off hander in game atm. Too big of a damage penalty in off hand to give up the proc and extra crit %.
Aside from the semi-long afrit quest, you can get a nice set of claws from Aluul or I believe Zelahi both in Rahz Inkur, all 3 are around 70dps with damage ranges between 121 and 149.

Also the main reason I brought up the PEH skill was because the first two steps arent being considered as ability damage, its considered as auto attack damage. We all know the damage requires some attention. But the fact that it is considered auto attack damage, means it is not affected by other skills and abilities such as secret of celerity, errant strikes, etc. Which is an actual coding error or bug imo.
« Last Edit: May 25, 2007, 01:09:59 PM by Fusoya » Logged
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« Reply #5 on: May 25, 2007, 05:46:31 PM »

quinn flying kick need a updates! example 400% damage plus melee damage,
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Apoco
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« Reply #6 on: May 31, 2007, 10:20:51 AM »

Good idea about the stun 1st, lower mitigation then **BLAMO* providing the damage gets to where it needs to be.

I had a coversation going about HTH weapons with a couple of people and right now the Panthenon Ulak is arguably the best off hander. Right now god king / A claws are pretty much it for main hand.

Monk itemization is a known issue so I hope they throw more gear to help us along.

~QTM

Actually, from my testings, the character sheet's dps for off-hand isnt correct.  Using Handwrap of Torchbearer and Afrit Ulak or 2x Afrit Ulak is the best for dps overall.  Since the crit% on the SOTA Legendary is only giving us 2% at level 31 (confirmed from devs, just tooltip bug currently), at level 50, that equates to like .03% of a crit chance.  Hardly worth losing the extra dps or str from Afrit weapons.
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Quinn the Mighty
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« Reply #7 on: May 31, 2007, 01:34:16 PM »

Yeah, I was disappointed when I heard about they changed  % to crit to an actual numbers that scale.Thats going to drive down the price of Athem at least  laugh Still all things considered I am a bit disapointed in the Afrit Ulak. Why in gods name cant they give us damage and worth while stats it just boggles the mind.

Don't get me wrong the Damage on it is yummy but I think for time invested they could do better.

~QTM

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Apoco
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« Reply #8 on: May 31, 2007, 02:07:49 PM »

I would expect it to get upgraded again to Legendary sometime soon.  Or so a little birdy told me Smiley
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Moridan
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« Reply #9 on: June 01, 2007, 10:30:46 AM »

Yeah, I was disappointed when I heard about they changed  % to crit to an actual numbers that scale.Thats going to drive down the price of Athem at least  laugh Still all things considered I am a bit disapointed in the Afrit Ulak. Why in gods name cant they give us damage and worth while stats it just boggles the mind.

Don't get me wrong the Damage on it is yummy but I think for time invested they could do better.

~QTM



Has anyone ever seen the Afrit Ulak ever proc?  In the last patch, all of the afrit weapons were changed to procs that affected all mobs, but more damage vs the efret.  I have yet to see mine proc a single time on anything.
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Quinn the Mighty
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« Reply #10 on: June 01, 2007, 12:11:06 PM »

I would expect it to get upgraded again to Legendary sometime soon.  Or so a little birdy told me Smiley

As long as it gets a buff to make it worth the legendary tag GREAT!!!!

~QTM
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Zarthaz
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« Reply #11 on: June 01, 2007, 07:33:34 PM »

Hmm, in regard to the afrit ulak i am not sure if mine is bugged.
  It does not show the Chance to hit: Efreet Supremacy  thingamabob on the tooltip
 It does show on the afrit dagger the bard in our group has.
Also have not seen it proc, yet the preceeding version was a fairly prodigious proccer, wasn't bad at all.
 Have bugged it in game, but not sure if i should petition and have it possiblly replaced with one that does show the :Chance on hit: etc etc  on tooltip, if that is even possible.

 Z
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Apoco
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« Reply #12 on: June 02, 2007, 01:02:28 PM »

Hmm, in regard to the afrit ulak i am not sure if mine is bugged.
  It does not show the Chance to hit: Efreet Supremacy  thingamabob on the tooltip
 It does show on the afrit dagger the bard in our group has.
Also have not seen it proc, yet the preceeding version was a fairly prodigious proccer, wasn't bad at all.
 Have bugged it in game, but not sure if i should petition and have it possiblly replaced with one that does show the :Chance on hit: etc etc  on tooltip, if that is even possible.

 Z

That is being fixed also, already fixed just needs to be pushed to a patch.

Everyone else -- (point scale is not accurate, but it is good for example)
The way itemization works is such:

Level 50 Blue: 50 points
+15 stat = 10 points
Lower Speed = 25 points
+ 15 Resistance = 5 points
Proc = 10 points

Level 50 Yellow: 75 points
+15 stat = 10 points
Lower Speed = 25 points
+ 15 Resistance = 5 points
Proc = 10 points
Higher dmg range = 25 points

Level 50 Orange: 100 Points
+30 stat = 35 points
Lower Speed = 25 points
+ 15 Resistance = 5 points
Proc = 10 points
Higher dmg range = 25 points

Level 50 Legendary: 125 points
+30 stat = 35 points
Lower Speed = 25 points
+ 15 Resistance = 5 points
Better Proc = 35 points
Higher dmg range = 25 points


With this system, every tier of an item, HAS to use all its points, so if an item gets upgraded to rare/heroic/legendary etc it HAS to get a stat boost, otherwise the game wont allow it in.  Now wether or not we feel it's stats are worth legendary or not, is up to personal opinion, but all points have been used.  This is the first mmo that has done a system like this, and it allows for more itemization and balancing.

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