I dunno, I keep seeing you push for having the monk be this flexible jack of all trades class, and I for one am not interested. I like the confirmed role that Quinn has stated the devs say the monk should be. That is the highest Base dps class, only being surpassed by a Ranger longer in the fight and a Rogue who is using his stealth abilities.

Your suggestion almost reminds me of a bard, except its not through songs a monk would get his versatility but his stance swapping etc. I dont want to be a Jack of all trades, master of none. Keep that for another class, I want a pure dps class that no other can surpass unless they use their class abilities to the max. THATS the monk for me and I can imagine most people who play the monk class.

I like their concept of three styles, it allows each person to specialize in what they like to do, DPS/Defense/Debuffs. I think one player getting all three is way overpowered. We would be the best at dps, the best offensive fighter tank, and the best debuffer in one class at one time, no thanks.

It sounds to me like, from your posts, you hsould be a harmonious monk, they are the most versatile "stance" for the monk class. Me I like dragon and DPS thats what I want, yummy.

I'm not pushing for anything the Monk isn't already, I'm just pushing for the Monk to perform better.

What I outlined is basically what the Monk already is: Three different forms with three different purposes. Damage, utility, and offtanking.

What the Monk really needs, aside from improving the three forms, would be to allow him to switch on the fly - Because it's very limiting for the Monk to choose only one role.
Why would you want to be an offtanking drunken monk for life when you could have just rolled a warrior?
Why be a Dragon when you could have been a Ranger or Rogue?
Harmonious is the only thing that would set the Monk apart, but his utility is only on par with a Ranger and far inferior to a Bard.

The key to the Monk living up to his potential is to allow him to switch between all forms.


No. The monk was never intended to be a pure DPS class, and that's reflected in the three forms they do have.

And it would be nonsensical to make the Monk a pure DPS class when we've already got the Ranger and Rogue - The monk needs to set himself apart from the other offensive fighters while still being useful. And what I propose does that.


What I suggest is nothing even remotely like a Bard. Think harder.


Then play a Rogue, and focus on pure DPS.
Or play a Bard and focus on utility.

VG Monks are conceptually about flexibility, and what I propose is a very powerful form of versatility.

It gives the Monk the option in Dragon to out DPS a ranger. It give them the option in Drunken to be the best off tank of the lighter fighters. It gives them the option in Harmonious to be a very well rounded light fighter with utility like the Ranger.


Forcing players to choose one path is a fundamentally flawed design, as we can now see, for two reasons.

1. It splits the ability list in three, so Monks get very few abilities relative to other classes and go long periods without upgrades.

2.  No matter which form you choose, there's a class that is going to perform your job better. So the only saving grave for the Monk form system would be if he had the capability to switch between them on the fly. It's ok not to be the best at one thing if you're capable of filling many roles.



What I propose doesn't make Monks the best at everything at once. It allows them to become really good at one thing at a time, to fill gaps in a team.

The Ranger is still the class that combines those three spheres at once the best.
The Monk can't do all three things as well as a Ranger at once, but the Monk CAN choose to do one of those things better at a time.
That's where the destiny of the Monk class is, if we want to it be useful and unique at the same time.

Whatever happened to the monk being the masters of exposing/exploiting weaknesses. I could have sworn I read that somewhere. Perhaps if something was played into a bit more involving this system it would give the monks a way to bolster their own dps while adding some useful, unique skills to bring to a group.

We have a agro reduction abilty called feign death read up about it!

Sorry to burst your bubble Aeronis but your version sucks, plain and simple. Also its already stated that the devs want monks to be the highest base dps offensive fighter, get over it and stop trying to peddle your garbage; you are the only one who wants a class thats subpar to three separate styles, mastering none.. you want that role a bard or something, leave monks to the dps minded martial artists.

Wrong. The Monk has about 130 abilities with all three forms combined, and every other class has about 130 abilities total.

The problem with the Monk being restricted to one path right now is they actually have about 1/3 the amount of abilities that other classes do. It's a huge problem for monks.

Mbnks were clearly intended to have access to all the abilities at once at some point.



The monk is already the master of nothing, being forced to choose one path that other classes could have done better.

What I propose is that the Monk be able to actually master one path a time, and switch between them so he's not locked into a single limiting role. Because when he's locked into a single role you run into the problem of the Monk being faced with other classes who can do their given job better.
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The Problem with single paths right now:
-You lock yourself into pure DPS with dragon, but find yourself inferior to Rogues, Rangers, and some casters.
-You lock yourself in Drunken and find that Rangers are about the same in off tanking, and if you wanted to be a dedicated secondary tank you should have just rolled a defensive fighter.
-You lock yourself in harmonious and find you can do a bit of everything but you master none of it, so there's really nothing a monk brings to a team that another class couldn't do better.
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Under my suggestion the Monk can be the highest base DPS in Dragon, he can be the best off tanker in Drunken, and he can be well rounded with team utility in Harmonious.

Everything I suggested only enhances what the monk is, not taking away anything from how people want to play him.

None of that is even remotely like a Bard, and the fact that you keep believing it is shows the extent to which you have not even bothered to read or understanding what I've posted.



Like it or not, that's what he already is. He has three different style paths to pursue, and he is the master of nothing.

My suggestion improves the monk on two fronts - First off he becomes a better specialist in whatever form he's in, and second he can switch between forms so that he can fit any situation.

Martial artists are all about flexibility, having the tools to deal with any situation. On talking about the various types of martial arts, Bruce Lee once said that a martial artist should be like water, flowing to take the shape of whatever is required, not locking themselves into one type of martial arts that purports to be anything and everything they need.



The Monk fits that description right now. But you guys still want more DPS, because you've found that only really outdamaging a bard and having little utility is not that effective after all.

And under my suggestion the Monk still fits that description in harmonious and Drunken, but under Dragon he has the capability to do more damage than the Ranger (which comes at the cost of a Dragon having less defense and utility than a Ranger)




Know your role. If you picked the Monk expecting to be the ultimate in DPS, as some here did, then you picked the wrong class.
Like or not that's the reality. The Monk was never intended to be the top of DPS among light fighters - That's for the Rogue and Ranger.

I would like to quote a portion of Kagekiri's post in the other thread here as I agree 100% with his view:

"The three subclasses of the monk should be able to produce the same dps, be it from out right damage - ie. my fist smashes nose technique - or a combination of weakness + exploit attack - ie. I evade your attack apply sweeping leg technique which breaks your balance and your stunned for a few secs so my weaker fist attacks can land unanswered. Same DPS just achieved differently.  These differences can also give variation, like harmonius can stun more as the need too so they can get off their dps attacks exploit, this is an advantage in group play as other players in the group can take advantage of this.  IN END GAME - their should really be no difference between the 3 subclasses when it comes to DPS, they may approach DPS differently but the end result will be the same."

I vote that all 3 monk subclasses should deal almost exact same amount of DPS, through slightly different means.  On top of the DPS, the 3 monk subclasses should each FOCUS on its respective extra expertise, not jack-of-all-trades style, but EXCEL in it.  As of now, each subclass do a little bit of something that hardly matters.  Dragons do a little bit of AoE and a tiny bit of DOT.  I want dragons to have SCARY AOE that rival a sorcerer's and an insane DoT that truely hurts.  I want Harmonious monks to have debuffs that truely cripples a mob, not just scratch off 10% dps.  I want Drunken monks to truely tank and taunt and evade, all done in a goofy drunken manner, not just stand there and be a pretty mana sponge.

I do not feel a merger of all 3 monk subclasses is either viable or desirable, i do agree however that we should have our number of useful skills bumped up significantly (assuming the skill count of each monk subclass vs other classes is indeed lacking - i'm too lazy to count myself).  Monk individuality should be emphasized, instead of everyone merge into one.