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Vanguard Monks  |  Monk Discussion  |  Monk General  |  Openers, bridges & finishers « previous next »
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Author Topic: Openers, bridges & finishers  (Read 1330 times)
Jun'Shi Quan
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« on: January 23, 2007, 08:58:37 PM »

OK, so I've not done any chains in game yet.  I'm not clear on how they work at all.  How do we know which of our skills are openers, bridges or finishers?   Could this information be added to the skills list?
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Jun'Shi Quan
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« Reply #1 on: January 24, 2007, 10:57:28 AM »

Interesting, apparently nobody knows?   Is this not something that monks can actually do?
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Cannonball
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« Reply #2 on: January 24, 2007, 11:35:18 AM »

Here is how it works, if you get a crit attack with a special it will allow you to do a finisher like The Jumping Spin Kick.  You only have a short amount of time to pull it off though, but it is visible that you can do it by a green bar decreasing in the little box you click on.  Also the box will light up to notify you the technique can be pulled off.  Once you get higher, these finishers become like bridges to other finishers, where after you crit with, say the jumping spin kick, then you can activate an even more powerful finisher after that.  So essentially your early finishers will become bridges to later finishers.

I hope that helps a bit.
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Jun'Shi Quan
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« Reply #3 on: January 24, 2007, 11:49:25 AM »

Man, tough crowd here, got kicked twice for asking a question!  Thanks for the reply Cannonball.   Where can this information be found without asking in a forum (apparently that gets you kicked)?  What are the openers?  Any normal attack that you crit on?
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Cannonball
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« Reply #4 on: January 24, 2007, 11:54:37 AM »

Pretty much anything but an auto attack will act as an opener as far as I know.  The bridges are specific though in what they open up though.

Also, I don't know where it can be found.  I figured it out when I was playing in Beta.
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Ninbei
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« Reply #5 on: January 24, 2007, 11:57:38 AM »

For now, it is hard to tell if an attack skill is an opener, bridge, or finisher.  Even worse, it's even harder to tell what kind of pre-requisits are there to trigger the skill.  The in-game tooltip sometimes tell u if it's a finisher or advanced finisher, and what skill it follows, but it's really unclear.

With my limited beta experience, i've made the following conclusion:

Openers: Boundless Fist, Ashen Hand, Crescent Kick, Divine Whirlwind
Finishers: Flying Kick, Thousand Fists, Divine Typoon
ADV Finishers: Kick of the Heavens, Thundering Fists, Divine Avalanche

It works like this:
Choose Any Opener -> Choose Any Finisher -> Choose the ADV Finisher that follows
ie you can open with bounless fist, and then flying kick, and then kick of the heavens
you can also do ashen hand, then flying kick, then kick of the heavens
but you CANNOT do ashen hand, then flying kick, then thundering fists (because thundering fists is NOT the adv finisher of flying kick)

NOTE: In order to progress to the next step in the chain, you NEED TO SCORE A CRITICAL HIT!
ie If you open with Boundless Fists and it critical hits, then you may choose a finisher.  If your finisher also crits, then you may choose to do an ADV finisher.
If you open with Boundless Fists and it did NOT crits, then the chain ends here.

NOTE2: The Divine AOE line (whirlwind, typhoon and avalanche) may be bugged or I'm too stupid to figure it out, but i have never ever gotten it to work.  Maybe the line doesnt work off crits.  I have no idea.
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Jun'Shi Quan
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« Reply #6 on: January 24, 2007, 02:29:32 PM »

Excellent information Ninbei,  thanks for the post.  Seems this is still a very unclear area, with many chains that still need to be figured out.
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Kaji
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« Reply #7 on: January 24, 2007, 03:03:02 PM »

I may need you guys to help me on this...  I have all the data in my abilities database from screenshots I took of every ability on-screen, but I'm not 100% sure on the rules and how to interpret the icons.  Give me a couple of days to fill out the data, and I'll try to write some code to make these combos clear in the ability details pages.
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Ninbei
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« Reply #8 on: January 24, 2007, 11:15:43 PM »

The tooltip in-game doesnt tell you much though.  For example it never says if a counterattack skill works by dodging first or evade or parry.  Hope they fix this after release.

Supposedly, when an icon lights up in the chain/counterattack area with a shortening green bar it means all requirements for that special ability has been made and is usable before the bar runs out.  The green bar lasts for around 4 ~ 5 seconds for finishers and adv finishers, and about 1 second for counterattacks.

So if u just successfully dodged and the Backhand Fist counterattack lights up, you may click it before the green bar runs out to use it.  HOWEVER if your character did an autoattack before u have the chance to click, the counterattack will not be available anymore even if the icon is still lit and the green bar still counting.  This rule does not apply to finishers, u can wait as long as the green bar doesnt run out.

Divine typhoon is a wierd one, as everytime i click it when it lights up it still says i havnt met certain requirements.. (then why did it light up in the first place).
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Jakik
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« Reply #9 on: January 24, 2007, 11:34:42 PM »

One thing im curious about with the ADV Finishers. Do These only trigger from critical hits from the normal Finisher? For example While fighting those dragons outside of KHal on my level 35 monk i would hittin all the finishing flying kicks but rarly did the ADV finisher Trigger. I Did pay attention to wether i missed the finisher or not and most of the time i did no miss so im curious is it just a random trigger chance or does the ADV finishers trigger from crit hits like i hear normal Finishers do.
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Jakik
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Jun'Shi Quan
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« Reply #10 on: January 25, 2007, 06:25:50 AM »

Do we have anything similar to the Disciples Endowment that works every time?  For the Disciple they can do a 3 part chain that seems to work everytime regardless of crits or anything else.   Here's an example of what I'm talking about:

Endowment of Life:  Blessed Wind-> Cyclone Kick-> Void Hand Instant Heal to defensive target. Effectiveness depends on the level of BW, CK, VH, and vitality  4 .   

It seems they can use it whenever they want, it doesn't require a crit or any sort of opening or anything.
« Last Edit: January 25, 2007, 06:40:43 AM by Jun'Shi Quan » Logged
Ninbei
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« Reply #11 on: January 25, 2007, 07:25:59 AM »

The only thing that works everytime for monks are the openers :/
Oh and our 200hp-once-every-5-minute-heal
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Kaji
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« Reply #12 on: January 25, 2007, 07:40:57 AM »

The tooltip in-game doesnt tell you much though.  For example it never says if a counterattack skill works by dodging first or evade or parry.  Hope they fix this after release.

It's actually more annoying than that.  There is a lot of info misisng from the in-game tool tip, including LEVEL (so, for my lvl 35 buffed toon, I had no idea when he could have trained his dragon mastery skills.)  That's why it's taking me so long to get the ability list updated.  Wink
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sift
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« Reply #13 on: January 26, 2007, 01:25:23 AM »

Way it's set up:
You have several abilitys you can use at any time, for example: Bounless Fist.
These are regular abilities.  However when they critical they may be continued into a Finisher.
Provided you have an Advanced Finisher, you can then continue the combo further.
As far as I know, criticaling on the finisher is not necessary for the advanced finisher, though I may be mistaken.

The old system of Opener -> Bridge -> Finisher was disgarded but re-worked in more sexily.  Basically, when you critical you can start a chain of attacks provided you meet the requirements (Costs and Timers).  Better yet, you can click on which one you want to use on your screen as opposed to needing to set up hotkeys.  On top of that, you can simply hit the 'G' key further the combo (ever since 'F' was changed to assist defensive target).

I had no idea when he could have trained his dragon mastery skills.)  That's why it's taking me so long to get the ability list updated.  Wink

To learn any of the style-specific skills, you must finish the quest to become a disciple of that style.  Then, you must attain the appopriate level for the skill (which is not determinable at this time).  Finally, you must meditate up to 6 or more Jin, then use Aum of *Style* Mastery for a chance to learn the new abilities.
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